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 Post subject: Templar Technology
PostPosted: 30 Nov 2011 11:43 am 
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Grand Master
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In a lot of Hollywood movies is shown, that a cave or vault is filled with water. If somebody want to get access, the water flows out in a short time, and the room is dry and ready to enter.

The other case is that a cave is locked by a system, which let water stream into the room an fill it in seconds, and the people who try to enter have no chance to get out and die.

I found a solution which is very genius and simple. It could be used in the 13 th century, because it works without electrical energy and has no moving parts. It needs no service and no manpower.

I construct such a system in laboratory size and it works absolutly fine.

This system is probably used in Oak Island.

How can such a system work ? Is it possible that it works until today ? Does such a system exist ? What kind of technology is able to drive that system without any high pressure pumps and electrical energy ?

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 Post subject: Re: Templar Technology
PostPosted: 30 Nov 2011 8:30 pm 
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Hi there,

here is the report of the experience:


The question was : how is a waterlocked subterrain vault working ?


What I have got out of several altar-paintings is, that they had build vaults underneath the cathedrals, which are placed in the groundwater. They are not able to build a vault, which is water-tight. The air will slightly move through the walls and the water will fill the vault for ever.

But the templars had a genius system to get such a vault dry and hold the waterlevel in a constant altitude. If they want, the vault can be flooded or get dry again, as we can see in the movies in the cinema. This system works with a genius pump, without any moving parts. The pump can be caved in a rock, which makes shure, that it will work for centuries.
It works like this : water in a river is streaming through the pump which is formed like a nozzle. In the nozzle is a little hole, where air can be sucked in. The water flows with highspeed through the nozzle and the air will be mixed into the water as little bubbles. This air/watermix flows with high pressure under the vault and the bubbles are swimming upwards into the vault. The air becomes collected in the vault, and keeps the water outside.

The question of the experiment was : If a vault is flooded (full of water), is it possible to get the water out again?

The result was a 100% " yes " - it works absolutly safe and powerful.

I used an aquarium, a salatbouwl as a vault and the "river" is my 3 bar watersupply in the house.

In the beginning of the experiment, the water is not streaming, and the bowl is full of water. As soon as I get the water flow, the airbubbles flow out of the gardenhose and get up into the vault, where they are collected and get the water out of the vault. With this little nozzle it took 4 minutes to get 2 liter water out . With a real nozzle we can get a real vault (6 m in diameter) dry in about 2 or three hours. To let the vault be flooded , you have to close the air-inlet of the nozzle; the vault fills slightly with water. To get it out again, you have to open the air-inlet. It is amazing. The form of the nozzle is like a " T " which is upside down. I have seen that symbol on the wall in churches.
..
Attachment:
00Versuchaufbau.jpg
Attachment:
1Gewölbe voll .jpg
Attachment:
2 Systemstart.jpg

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Last edited by hans peper on 30 Nov 2011 8:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Templar Technology
PostPosted: 30 Nov 2011 8:43 pm 
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Grand Master
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Attachment:
3 erstes drittel leer.jpg
Attachment:
5 fertig.jpg


Now the airbubbles are flowing under the edge of the bowl out of the vault into the groundwater. The waterlevel will be absolutly constant.
You will understand what happens if you drill a hole into the top of the vault ! The system will collapse and the vault will be filled with water in seconds.

The nozzle is a socalled venturi nozzle, which is rediscoverd in the 18 th century by Bernoulli and Venturi.
Attachment:
venturidüse.jpg

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 Post subject: Re: Templar Technology
PostPosted: 01 Dec 2011 10:51 am 
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oooh...what an interesting post. i'm off to check your findings...get the buckets, mops and towels ready :D

would you not get too much oxygen in the air to think straight ?


Last edited by Sheila on 01 Dec 2011 10:59 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Templar Technology
PostPosted: 01 Dec 2011 10:58 am 
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Thank you for your reply,

but without the venturi-nozzle, which produces the air/watermix you will have no success.

But try to take a gardenhose and drill a very small hole in it (with a needle) , maybe it helps. :P

Maybe it works (you can see the bubbles in the water) or it do not work ( the water flows out of the hole you have drilled) :D

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 Post subject: Re: Templar Technology
PostPosted: 01 Dec 2011 11:00 am 
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well...it seems to work in theory, what a great system...but, as i added above, would the air not be too heavy in oxygen ?


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 Post subject: Re: Templar Technology
PostPosted: 01 Dec 2011 11:17 am 
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Sheila wrote:
would the air not be too heavy in oxygen ?


please forgive me, my English is very poor. What do you mean ? :|

The gardenhose is connected with my watersupply at home and only water streams in it. The nozzle sucks normal air from outside and mix it into the water.
The water/airmix flows out of the gardenhose under the bowl. The airbubbles are swimming upward into the bowl and are pessing the water out of the bowl.

If all water is out, the air which is too much is flowing under the edge of the bowl out of it. So the bowl will be free of water as long as new air is streaming out of the hose. The bowl is watertight in spite of a vault made of bricks, where the air is flowing slightly throug the stones. But if more air is comming in than is flowing out through the stones, the vault stays dry.

If you close the airsupply-hole in the nozzle, no bubbles are beeing produced and the vault will be slightly flooded, because the air in the vault is flowing out between the bricks.

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 Post subject: Re: Templar Technology
PostPosted: 01 Dec 2011 11:35 am 
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Hans, You should "also" post over on the "Oak Island Forum". With the Michigan Mob, working on the treasure pit, there isn't much info coming out of there right now. Your posts would be welcomed.

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 Post subject: Re: Templar Technology
PostPosted: 01 Dec 2011 11:44 am 
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@ Hans,

if the air we breath is 78% Nitrogen and 20% oxygen....i just think that your method could produce too much oxygen, making it impossible to breath?

and how would you get into this vault...from underneath, through a siphon ?


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 Post subject: Re: Templar Technology
PostPosted: 01 Dec 2011 12:43 pm 
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Sheila wrote:
@ Hans,

if the air we breath is 78% Nitrogen and 20% oxygen....i just think that your method could produce too much oxygen, making it impossible to breath?

and how would you get into this vault...from underneath, through a siphon ?


Now I understand. No, the system does not produce oxygen. It produces a mix of water and normal air (which we are breathing).

how to get into the vault ? Two way are existing : first way is from underneath, but you must dive through a siphon - it is to uncomfortable.
The second way , and this is the normal way, is a kind of airlock.This airlock was discovered in Oak Island. But the people who found it, did not the right things to go in. So they triggered a trap and the water comes up. If you will go through an airlock, you have to close the first door, befor you open the second door. If you do not , the system will collapse and the water will flood the whole system.(explosive decompression) :P

This kind of vaults under the cathedrals are not build for going in a lot of times every day. It is constructed to store something for a long time and it is also constructed to annother secret use.

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 Post subject: Re: Templar Technology
PostPosted: 01 Dec 2011 12:53 pm 
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wayward wrote:
Hans, You should "also" post over on the "Oak Island Forum". With the Michigan Mob, working on the treasure pit, there isn't much info coming out of there right now. Your posts would be welcomed.


For the money pit it is too late. They have produced an explosive decompression. The only chance they have is to close all the drillingholes and to rebuild the airlock (the two layers of wood and paste) in the money pit and hope, that the system is still working and get the water out again. But I think that there are too many holes in the system.

If ALL of the holes are closed, there is a chance. After waiting a month, they can begin to go in the airlock, close the upper layer of wood and paste, open the second layer and no water will come. But I think the systen looks like a cheese from switzerland.

I think that oak Island is lost for ever. If you see my experiment and you understand how it works, you can imagine what happens, if you drill holes into the "salatbowl".

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 Post subject: Re: Templar Technology
PostPosted: 02 Dec 2011 7:11 pm 
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Hans what do you think is buried at Oak Island
just theorize

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 Post subject: Re: Templar Technology
PostPosted: 02 Dec 2011 8:22 pm 
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hi lovuian,

a good question. My profession is to find systems like this on Oak Island, and to find the access to it. I found, that the system on Oak Island is according to the systems I found under cathedrals and castles.

I am sure, that it was not build by pirates, because it is too much complicated for them and too much work.

The first idea I had is that the templars had burried their treasures on the island after they dissapeared from Europe.

But there is annother possibility. Before I can give an answer, I must know a fact :

In what direction is the water streaming outgoing from Oak Island ? Is it streaming to Halifax or annother city ? Or is it streaming into the open Atlantic ?

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 Post subject: Re: Templar Technology
PostPosted: 02 Dec 2011 11:30 pm 
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it does seem like the Crusaders had knowledge of tunnel systems
as far as the currents I don't know

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 Post subject: Re: Templar Technology
PostPosted: 03 Dec 2011 6:03 am 
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Hi lovuian,

that is right, the crusaders found that knowledge in Jerusalem under the temple of Salomon.
They digged it out.

With that knowledge they return to Europe and after the loosing of Jerusalem, they began to build socalled gravechurches according to the grave church from Jerusalem. Under that buildings they set up the first type of this secret vaults.

One of them is still standing in Vera Cruz /Spain.

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 Post subject: Re: Templar Technology
PostPosted: 03 Dec 2011 4:36 pm 
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The Templar Iglesia Vera Cruz (Church of the True Cross) is the most interesting of several splendid Romanesque churches in Segovia.

the Templar Shrine to a fragment of the True Cross

a very good point Hans

Jerusalem had a tunnel system

Hezekiah became king of Judah, he built new fortifications and an underground tunnel which brought water from the Gihon Spring to the Pool of Siloam inside the city. This was an extraordinary engineering achievement, done with what are primitive tools by modern standards.

n 1880 an inscription was discovered. It had been cut into the tunnel wall, and describes the meeting of the two groups of stone-cutters who were digging from opposite ends of the tunnel:

'And this was the way in which it was cut through: While [...] (were) still [...] axe(s), each man toward his fellow, and while there were still three cubits to be cut through, [there was heard] the voice of a man calling to his fellows, for there was an overlap in the rock on the right [and on the left]. And when the tunnel was driven through, the quarrymen hewed (the rock), each man toward his fellow, axe against axe; and the water flowed from the spring toward the reservoir for 1200 cubits.'
http://www.bible-archaeology.info/jerusalem.htm

the tombs of the House David was near there

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 Post subject: Re: Templar Technology
PostPosted: 03 Dec 2011 7:38 pm 
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hans peper wrote:
hi lovuian,

a good question. My profession is to find systems like this on Oak Island, and to find the access to it. I found, that the system on Oak Island is according to the systems I found under cathedrals and castles.

I am sure, that it was not build by pirates, because it is too much complicated for them and too much work.

The first idea I had is that the templars had burried their treasures on the island after they dissapeared from Europe.

But there is annother possibility. Before I can give an answer, I must know a fact :

In what direction is the water streaming outgoing from Oak Island ? Is it streaming to Halifax or annother city ? Or is it streaming into the open Atlantic ?



I agree with Wayward,this would go down well on the Oak Island Treasure Forum.The theory of the MP as a water trap has the water coming in from Smiths Cove,and it is thought that there were also tunnels to the MP from the South Cove which would fit in as the outlet for your theory.
I'm off to check out your theory with the water nozzle,if it doesn't work I'll send you the bill:)

Dave


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 Post subject: Re: Templar Technology
PostPosted: 03 Dec 2011 11:12 pm 
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Hey Dave can you give him the link of the
Oak Island treasure forum

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 Post subject: Re: Templar Technology
PostPosted: 04 Dec 2011 4:03 am 
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Just type it into the search bar lov,you may have trouble getting it as a 403 forbidden notice has been coming up today,it may take a few days to go away.


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 Post subject: Re: Templar Technology
PostPosted: 04 Dec 2011 6:42 am 
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Dave Wood wrote:
... I'm off to check out your theory with the water nozzle,if it doesn't work I'll send you the bill:)Dave


Hi Dave,

be sure it will work. It is not a theory - I developed this experience and the photos are made by me. The nozzle I used, is made of brass (in German : Messing ). A turnerey made it for me. But they only do it if I buy 50 pieces. So a lot of them are stored by me at home. If you want, I can send you one (you must pay nothing). Just send a PM with a postadress .

Otherwise you can use nozzles from spray-pistols. The nozzle I used has an inletwide for the water of 2 cm and the smalest part in the middle is 4 mm. The inlet for the air is 0,1 mm.
But you can use every other dimensions.

I hope, I can send you a bill if it works and you dig out the treasure. It will be nice, if you can give a report how it works .

stay in touch
best regards and success

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 Post subject: Re: Templar Technology
PostPosted: 05 Dec 2011 7:51 pm 
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This is a drawing, how a water locked vault could be constructet.

..
Attachment:
gralsgewölbe.jpg

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 Post subject: Re: Templar Technology
PostPosted: 06 Dec 2011 5:45 am 
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There's a quick flowing river adjacent to the Al Aqsa Mosque....?? :shock:

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 Post subject: Re: Templar Technology
PostPosted: 06 Dec 2011 7:08 am 
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rs2008 wrote:
There's a quick flowing river adjacent to the Al Aqsa Mosque....?? :shock:


This drawing is an older one, after new findings is a normal river enough to drive the nozzle. You only need a difference in water altitudes. Just as water mills did.
There is flowing water in Jerusalem and they have a large tunnel system.

I read, that the Knights Templar digged out a large tunnel system under the temple of salomon.

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 Post subject: Re: Templar Technology
PostPosted: 06 Dec 2011 7:46 am 
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Thanks. My schoolboy physics is a bit rusty, but you need a fair amount of air pressure to force the water out, and especially up. Check with any submariner.
I'm not convinced your device would operate effectively in situ, I just don't think you could get enough pressure to i) evacuate the grailvault, and ii) maintain it unflooded without the occupants having to wear a G-suit. But it's a cute theory.........now hang on Hans, don't tell me those Templar Knights had a rudimentary G-suit in their armoury, even Dan Beige didn't think of that. :wink:

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 Post subject: Re: Templar Technology
PostPosted: 06 Dec 2011 8:43 am 
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rs2008 wrote:
Thanks. My schoolboy physics is a bit rusty, but you need a fair amount of air pressure to force the water out,


Yes, this was exactly my meaning before I did the experiment.

I know an engineer from the greatest under water digging company of the world. He was the same meaning as you are, but after looking to my experiment, he pulls back and said : "This gives me a few nights without a sleep. A genius simple system."

He also agrees, that it was practible in the 13th century by the Templars and it could work for centuries without any service and renovation.

Notice : there is no high pressure needed ! The pressure in the chamber is about 2 bar.

Do the experiment by yourself and you will understand. I can send you a nozzle as a gave.

regards to downunder

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