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PostPosted: 22 Mar 2016 8:26 am 
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Your interpretation of Barbarians picture is just like jokers do. The question is not what animals you see, the question is : What do we have there ? What was there ?

I'm sure, that there was (or is) not a giant rabbit with a cat, laying side by side.

This can't be, because the cat will kill the rabbit at once.
You both know nothing about cats, well?

regards Hans

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PostPosted: 22 Mar 2016 9:06 am 
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hans peper wrote:
.

Your interpretation of Barbarians picture is just like jokers do. The question is not what animals you see, the question is : What do we have there ? What was there ?

I'm sure, that there was (or is) not a giant rabbit with a cat, laying side by side.

This can't be, because the cat will kill the rabbit at once.
You both know nothing about cats, well?

regards Hans


I don't know about rabbits, but I once had a cat that became very old, 19 years.

If you look very carefully at the top part you could see some dark box shaped somethings. 8)

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PostPosted: 22 Mar 2016 9:47 am 
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Yes, I see.

And something is on it's left.

Regards Hans

Ps. We had a break out with the traffic in the forum :lol:

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PostPosted: 22 Mar 2016 2:15 pm 
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hans peper wrote:
.

Your interpretation of Barbarians picture is just like jokers do. The question is not what animals you see, the question is : What do we have there ? What was there ?

I'm sure, that there was (or is) not a giant rabbit with a cat, laying side by side.

This can't be, because the cat will kill the rabbit at once.
You both know nothing about cats, well?

regards Hans


Sorry if I offended you Hans, or BS. But yes, I was partly joking. Usually we associated rabbits with Easter, and Easter with Spring, Spring brings warm weather...therefore I saw a rabbit... which makes me think of warmer weather. Image


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PostPosted: 22 Mar 2016 4:40 pm 
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Dont worry, I wasnt offended 8)

But the picture carries more than a rabbit in a hat.

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PostPosted: 22 Mar 2016 7:10 pm 
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Crimson_Ghost wrote:
Caelum wrote:
Crimson_Ghost wrote:

I can`t believe I`m saying this but, I see what looks like a rabbit in that field. Maybe I`m getting spring fever...


Sitting with either a cat, or an owl, right?


:lol: No. A dark portion looked like the outline of a rabbit. Like I said, perhaps the wish for spring weather was a factor.


Damn! I looked and immediately saw a rabbit and a cat (the two bright portions)!

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PostPosted: 22 Mar 2016 7:11 pm 
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hans peper wrote:
.

Your interpretation of Barbarians picture is just like jokers do. The question is not what animals you see, the question is : What do we have there ? What was there ?

I'm sure, that there was (or is) not a giant rabbit with a cat, laying side by side.

This can't be, because the cat will kill the rabbit at once.
You both know nothing about cats, well?

regards Hans


Actually my cat, dog and rabbit get along very well thank you!

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PostPosted: 23 Mar 2016 6:26 am 
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Caelum wrote:
hans peper wrote:
.

Your interpretation of Barbarians picture is just like jokers do. The question is not what animals you see, the question is : What do we have there ? What was there ?

I'm sure, that there was (or is) not a giant rabbit with a cat, laying side by side.

This can't be, because the cat will kill the rabbit at once.
You both know nothing about cats, well?

regards Hans


Actually my cat, dog and rabbit get along very well thank you!


But how did they come to the Razes ?

Hans

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PostPosted: 04 Apr 2016 8:13 am 
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Two maps from 1850 and somewhat before that.
You might find them interesting, or you might not. :lol:
I did.

Image

Image

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PostPosted: 04 Apr 2016 3:36 pm 
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Ancient quarry?

Quote:
Archaeologists from the Hebrew University of Jerusalem uncovered in central Israel the earliest known Neolithic quarry in the southern Levant, dating back 11,000 years. Finds from the site indicate large-scale quarrying activities to extract flint and limestone for the purpose of manufacturing working tools. - See more at: http://www.ancient-origins.net/news-his ... V0Iw5.dpuf


Image

Screenshot from here - where the article is:

http://www.ancient-origins.net/news-his ... ape-005627

It made me remember a location I found last fall, halfway between Serres and Les Pontils.
A half steep slope on the south/east side of the road, stretching down to the Rialsesse.
What was strange was that is was completely full of more or less round holes - hundreds of small holes about the size of a fist.
I assumed at the time that water once formed them.
Yet, I haven't seen this phenomena anywhere else in the area - not like this - though I have walked my share of river beds in the Aude. And the holes stretch all the way up to the road. For water to reach the top holes and create them, it would have to happened very long ago and they should have been eroded by now.
So, that article in the link above made think if these holes could be manmade as well?

Some of my photos from the area in question:

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Location is the rock seen at the center of this satellite image:

Image

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PostPosted: 04 Apr 2016 9:17 pm 
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looks like plain old Carboniferous Limestone to me.


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PostPosted: 04 Apr 2016 10:05 pm 
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Sheila wrote:
looks like plain old Carboniferous Limestone to me.


Maybe. But isn't that a mostly British islands phenomena?

Going through the pictures on the world wide web and comparing, I really don't think this looked like Carboniferous Limestone. These were more like a lot of round holes. And it didn't extend beyond that concentrated spot - perhaps 20x20 meters - or less.

However, if it is Carboniferous Limestone we are looking at then Wiki says it was mined for metals in the old days.
And chances for caves sub-surface are supposed to be very good.

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PostPosted: 05 Apr 2016 5:42 am 
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Barbarian Storm wrote:
Sheila wrote:
looks like plain old Carboniferous Limestone to me.


Maybe. But isn't that a mostly British islands phenomena?

Going through the pictures on the world wide web and comparing, I really don't think this looked like Carboniferous Limestone. These were more like a lot of round holes. And it didn't extend beyond that concentrated spot - perhaps 20x20 meters - or less.

However, if it is Carboniferous Limestone we are looking at then Wiki says it was mined for metals in the old days.
And chances for caves sub-surface are supposed to be very good.



According to the geological maps of the area the limestone of the area is Cretaceous (93 to 110 million years old) not Carboniferous (300 million years old) !!! There's only a couple of hundred million years difference.


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PostPosted: 05 Apr 2016 7:05 am 
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Sheila wrote:
looks like plain old Carboniferous Limestone to me.


sorry i should have been more specific...

Large uncovered bedrock slab of Schisto-gréseuses imperméables du Carbonifère which is part of the 1,100 m thick layer that sits on top of the thermal waters of Rennes les Bains, basically capturing the thermal aquifer between it and the lower Devonian layer.

Whatever the rock is, it's located quite well down in the river bed of La Rialsesse which once covered the valley.

Probably wrong but that's what i reckoned.


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PostPosted: 05 Apr 2016 8:08 am 
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The holes made me think of hoof prints and they still do.
Though of course they aren't.

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PostPosted: 05 Apr 2016 9:04 am 
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Well, it's pretty close to where the Rialsesse comes in from the east, just after the river bend.
Perhaps water passing around the bend is what created the holes. Or... something else.

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PostPosted: 05 Apr 2016 10:40 pm 
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Barbarian Storm wrote:
Two maps from 1850 and somewhat before that.
You might find them interesting, or you might not. :lol:
I did.


The Rennes/Bains de Rennes naming convention is interesting. It makes me think "Here is Rennes and down there are the baths."

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PostPosted: 05 Apr 2016 10:42 pm 
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Barbarian Storm wrote:
Ancient quarry?

Quote:
Archaeologists from the Hebrew University of Jerusalem uncovered in central Israel the earliest known Neolithic quarry in the southern Levant, dating back 11,000 years. Finds from the site indicate large-scale quarrying activities to extract flint and limestone for the purpose of manufacturing working tools. - See more at: http://www.ancient-origins.net/news-his ... V0Iw5.dpuf


Image

Screenshot from here - where the article is:

http://www.ancient-origins.net/news-his ... ape-005627

It made me remember a location I found last fall, halfway between Serres and Les Pontils.
A half steep slope on the south/east side of the road, stretching down to the Rialsesse.
What was strange was that is was completely full of more or less round holes - hundreds of small holes about the size of a fist.
I assumed at the time that water once formed them.
Yet, I haven't seen this phenomena anywhere else in the area - not like this - though I have walked my share of river beds in the Aude. And the holes stretch all the way up to the road. For water to reach the top holes and create them, it would have to happened very long ago and they should have been eroded by now.
So, that article in the link above made think if these holes could be manmade as well?



Just throwing this in for interest sake:

http://oldeuropeanculture.blogspot.com/ ... tones.html

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PostPosted: 06 Apr 2016 5:38 am 
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Location: Livingston, Scotland.
Sheila wrote:
Sheila wrote:
looks like plain old Carboniferous Limestone to me.


sorry i should have been more specific...

Large uncovered bedrock slab of Schisto-gréseuses imperméables du Carbonifère which is part of the 1,100 m thick layer that sits on top of the thermal waters of Rennes les Bains, basically capturing the thermal aquifer between it and the lower Devonian layer.

Whatever the rock is, it's located quite well down in the river bed of La Rialsesse which once covered the valley.

Probably wrong but that's what i reckoned.


"Schisto-gréseuses imperméables du Carbonifère" are the impermeable schists and gritstones of the Carboniferous period NOT limestones. What is happening is that water in a permeable layer is trapped under pressure between two impermeable layers and is forced to the surface.

All this is happening deep underground and is nothing whatsoever with what Barbarian Storm has photographed.

I suggest what Barbarian Storm is looking at are rocks from the Cretaceous period that contain a mixture of deposits such as pebbles or soluble compounds which weather at different rates and either detach or disappear from the bedrock. The shape of the depressions suggest natural weathering not man made interference. The shape and distribution of the depressions is different from the cups in the cup and ring marked rocks in various parts of the British isles. (Research by the University of Durham)

Varsity of Durham... ahh...that prompts a tune https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6KPDNWkhnck


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PostPosted: 06 Apr 2016 2:47 pm 
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Caelum wrote:
Barbarian Storm wrote:
Ancient quarry?

Quote:
Archaeologists from the Hebrew University of Jerusalem uncovered in central Israel the earliest known Neolithic quarry in the southern Levant, dating back 11,000 years. Finds from the site indicate large-scale quarrying activities to extract flint and limestone for the purpose of manufacturing working tools. - See more at: http://www.ancient-origins.net/news-his ... V0Iw5.dpuf


Image

Screenshot from here - where the article is:

http://www.ancient-origins.net/news-his ... ape-005627

It made me remember a location I found last fall, halfway between Serres and Les Pontils.
A half steep slope on the south/east side of the road, stretching down to the Rialsesse.
What was strange was that is was completely full of more or less round holes - hundreds of small holes about the size of a fist.
I assumed at the time that water once formed them.
Yet, I haven't seen this phenomena anywhere else in the area - not like this - though I have walked my share of river beds in the Aude. And the holes stretch all the way up to the road. For water to reach the top holes and create them, it would have to happened very long ago and they should have been eroded by now.
So, that article in the link above made think if these holes could be manmade as well?



Just throwing this in for interest sake:

http://oldeuropeanculture.blogspot.com/ ... tones.html



Yes, that is interesting.
And remember this thing we discussed earlier, that I found along the Rialsesse just a little bit to the west:

Image

Image

A lot of stone formed by man in this riverbed by the way.

Image

Image

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PostPosted: 06 Apr 2016 2:51 pm 
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Pilrig wrote:
Sheila wrote:
Sheila wrote:
looks like plain old Carboniferous Limestone to me.


sorry i should have been more specific...

Large uncovered bedrock slab of Schisto-gréseuses imperméables du Carbonifère which is part of the 1,100 m thick layer that sits on top of the thermal waters of Rennes les Bains, basically capturing the thermal aquifer between it and the lower Devonian layer.

Whatever the rock is, it's located quite well down in the river bed of La Rialsesse which once covered the valley.

Probably wrong but that's what i reckoned.


"Schisto-gréseuses imperméables du Carbonifère" are the impermeable schists and gritstones of the Carboniferous period NOT limestones. What is happening is that water in a permeable layer is trapped under pressure between two impermeable layers and is forced to the surface.

All this is happening deep underground and is nothing whatsoever with what Barbarian Storm has photographed.

I suggest what Barbarian Storm is looking at are rocks from the Cretaceous period that contain a mixture of deposits such as pebbles or soluble compounds which weather at different rates and either detach or disappear from the bedrock. The shape of the depressions suggest natural weathering not man made interference. The shape and distribution of the depressions is different from the cups in the cup and ring marked rocks in various parts of the British isles. (Research by the University of Durham)

Varsity of Durham... ahh...that prompts a tune https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6KPDNWkhnck


You're probably right.
Just strange that this rock look so different when compared to the rest of the area.

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PostPosted: 20 Nov 2016 8:36 pm 
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What the bridge restes upon.

Image

Image

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PostPosted: 08 Jan 2017 7:33 pm 
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It should not come as a surprise to you that I am quite convinced there's a partial visible trace of a Roman cadastral system at Serres. And would that really be so strange?

Now this system, with this specific tilt, could also gives us hints at when the area began to be developed by Romans, a possible timeframe that need to be looked into more.

See here:
https://quadralectics.wordpress.com/4-r ... ped-model/

Quote:
The basic layout of a Roman settlement, either military or civilian, consisted of two crossing main streets, the kardo (N-S) and the decumanus (E-W), and four blocks, called the centuria.

The Roman surveyors used a given set of geometric tools based on a cross, called the groma (or stella). This surveying instrument was depicted on a tombstone of Lucius Aebutius Faustus in the first century BC and was also found in a surveyor’s workshop in Pompeii during excavations in 1972. It is now in the Archaeological Museum of Naples (in a locked technical hall; DILKE, 1971/1992). The groma was used to determine right angles. The kardo maximus and the decumanus maximus were the most prominent to establish a new settlement (fig. 539). The former (KM) runs north – south, while the latter (DM) follows the east – west direction. These axes formed the structure for a centuriation (centuria) consisting – in an ideal case – of four times ten or twenty-five squares (‘Ab uno umbilico in quattuor partes omnis centuriarum ordo componitur’) (MÜLLER, 1961).

Deviations of this pattern are known and the direction of the layout (of the centuria) is sometimes changed in time, as was studied by CLAVEL-LÉVÊQUE and FAVORY (1992) in the areas of Nola (Naples) in Italy and Béziers in France. Three different types of networks were established in the latter area called the ager Baeterrensis. It is known that a scamnatio in centuriis (internal division and organization of a parcel of land) existed in the Béziers area at the end of the second and the first part of the first century BC. when the area must have been well populated. The direction of the roads followed the natural topographical features like rivers and streams, which is NW-SE and NE-SW (fig. 540). The Roman occupation in Gallia Narbonensis started with the campaigns of Julius Caesar from 58 BC onwards. Roman veterans of the VIIth Legion founded Béziers in 36-35 BC and their colonial presence had a marked influence on the countryside.



Image

The tilt is 25 degrees or 33 degrees.

Quote:
Fig. 540 – The structure of the colonial centuriations in the area of Béziers (France. The orientations of the lands (limites) is shown here as NW-SE and NE-SW, following the main features of the terrain and the road established by Domitian (via Domitia), who ruled the Roman Empire between 81 and 96 AD.

This initial pattern was superseded by a cadastral system, known as Béziers A, with a strict NS-EW pattern (fig. 541). This centuriation was dated (by Clavel & Favory) between the emperors Vespasian (69 – 79) and Hadrian (117 – 138). This fifty-year period overlaps the situation during the reign of Domitian and shows the difficulties of establishing a historical sequence in the various cadastral stages. One may wonder why the directions of centuriation changed within the given period. Also the difference between the direction in fig. 540 – around 25º NE – and the results of a later geo-archaeological-computing approach by Clavel-Lévêque et al resulting in a prevailing Roman cadastral system in the area of Beziers oriented at 33º needs further explanation.


Image

Quote:
Fig. 541 – This centuriation of the Béziers area of southern France, known as Béziers A, shows a stage of cadastral preference with a NS – EW orientation. It followed an earlier system based on more topographical elements.


Here is Serres.

I've lined up markers that follow the 33 degree tilt. There are quite a few, although I believe even more could be fit into the picture if you wanted to. Remember the land changes, boundaries have been moved, turned... a cadastral system is a living thing. Sometime changes are small, sometimes big. But parts of the system will be visible for a long time.

Image

Here on a black background:

Image

And when you look closely, it's possible to connect lines with a larger brushstroke.

Image

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PostPosted: 10 Feb 2017 1:56 pm 
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Very strange coincidence...

The double cross in the church of Serres, Aude:

Image

Newer landmark near Serres, Greece:

Image
Image

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PostPosted: 20 Aug 2017 10:18 pm 
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Some shades of dark and light in the Serres fields, oriented towards to the suggested ancient grid, suggesting there's something down there, under layers of soil.

Image

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